Thanks for all of that information. It gives me a lot to think about. I had already learned through trial and error that putting an ice pack on my neck seemed to help snap me back and I think this paper helps explain that.



I won't be taking my rectal temperature at the gym, but I might strap on the heart rate monitor to see what is happening when/if I crash again. I might also just make it a point to stand in front of fan between sets.

I am being stubborn and I'll acknowledge that. I also appreciate the concern and know that the comments are meant to be helpful.



While my routine smacks everyone else on this board as being stupid, I think its quite silly to point to the routine as the problem when my experience has shown that doing a lower rep/higher weight routine causes my body more problems.





How much are you thinking? The cereal has 13g of protein before you add in the milk.

http://store.kashi.com/golean_cereal.aspx?SID=1&Ca tegory_ID=68&

My daily diet is usually around 100g of protein and I'm not trying to get bigger.





I feel pretty confident that over exertion is the root cause, but what I'd really like to know is what the physiological issue is. That's been my question since the first post.

I normally eat a breakfast of a bowl of cereal, some OJ, and a handful of blueberries about 30 to 40 minutes before I work out. Blood sugar was my first guess.





No, and I won't be repeating the work out that caused the problem without changing it. My doctor and trainer both gave me the advice to listen to my body, but I don't hear it until I've already over shot things. Thus the log book and instructions to make only minor incremental changes. I just think that if I understood the physiology behind the problem better, I'd do a better job planning the weights for my routines.



As an aside, I had my first spell after the 2nd exercise in an 6 exercise, 18 set routine. The high volume routines have actually been easier for me to work with.

35 Minutes. I really appreciate all this concern about the quality of my work out and I'm sure you are all certain your advice is logical, but think of this. You've read a few posts of mine and have made recommendations. My trainer has been working with me for 9 months and has the results of my fitness evaluations, medical reports, and my doctor's input to design my programs.



Most professional trainers I've spoken to, and I shopped around, made a big deal of the fact that they wouldn't recommend a program until they'd worked with me and figured out what I was capable of.



Now, back to the reason I made this post. It sounds like other people have this same problem and have the same solutions. Does anyone have a link to a good medical paper on the physiological issues?

Yeah, I'm actually very happy with my trainer. He and his team have done a good job of working around my past injuries and goals.



The results pretty much speak for themselves. Since December I've dropped 7% body fat, lost 4lbs, and more than doubled my absolute strength in most of my muscle groups.

Oh, that's a great sign, but I'd rather avoid it. Since I never feel ill until after the fatal set, my best defense is to keep a careful log and never make a really large jump in weight regardless of how good I'm feeling.



Today's slip, like most occasions, happened when I changed the routine and I failed to anticipate how much the lunges were going to take out of me.

This is the routine my trainer helped me set up to improve my lower body endurance for riding.



Its been working really well so, no offense, but I'm not going to go changing it up based on a forum post.

I've gotten ill once during an upper body workout, but five of the six times this has happened it has been as I'm getting from under the leg press bar.



Before I changed up the routine I knew the weight that would set it off (485lbs) and just kept myself 50lbs or so under that.

I have a real problem with over exertion. I've already been to my doctor and I'm supposed to just keep better track of my work outs so I can try and judge when I'm over doing it.



Over did it by about one set today and I ended up a quivering mass on the floor for 20 minutes. For those wondering, "what did this schmuck do?" it went like this:

Normal Friday routine:

3x Squats

3x Deadlifts

3x Standing calf raises

3x Seated calf raises

3x Leg Press

3x Calf Press

3x Leg Curl

3x Back Extensions

3x Hanging Leg Lifts



Today I upped the weight on the squats and deadlifts, which I don't think was a big deal, but then I swapped my standing calf raises for lunges. I didn't realize it until I was on my third set of leg presses, but my quads were toast. I got up and I knew that inside of a minute I'd be trashed so I grabbed my water, sat down, and let the pain set in.



So I know what activity causes it, I know how to handle it, but I don't know the physiology behind it. Anyone have a clue?

The problem with the ratios is that they're a little too simplistic. They don't differentiate between fats that promote health and those that are bad for you. Of course, if we built a carefully detailed food model of what to eat, we'd have to spend all day doing math and analysis or hand over our food selection to professionals.

I my world they count.



My schedule is just slightly more frequent then yours (5:15, 7:00, 9:30, 11:30, 3:00, 6:00, 8:00) and a piece of meat and vegetables feels like a huge meal. Most of the time a "meal" is a bowl of cereal, a few pieces of fruit, or similar.



For tracking my food, I'll just use a piece of paper and a pencil in periods where I'm only loosely tracking and a spreadsheet for times when I want detail.

My diet is close to 25% fat, 50% carb, and 25% protein at ~1900 calories per day. I put minimal effort towards eating foods that are low in saturated fat and simple sugars. According to my doctor, I'm getting all the essentials and doing a pretty good job of maintaining my health.







As a snack, I like them. They fill me up more than a typical breakfast or snack bar and have comparable calorie counts.



As part of a plan to "bulk up" I think they're ridiculous. If you really need more protein, it is easier and cheaper to get more skim milk and chicken breasts. Some folks tell me they can't eat chicken every day, but then they chug down the same protein mix for months. At least chicken can be made into different meals.

The last time I let someone else dictate my fitness routine I was in high school and it didn't work very well.



These days I don't ever feel like I'm binging. Sure, there are days when I have something that blows aways my normal intake, but I make the choice and I'm OK with the consequences (more time in the gym or more digits on the scale).



My "diet" is how I eat. I wouldn't cut out sweets unless I planned to never have them again. No single food is the enemy, it is the amount that I was eating. (I'm pretty happy at my current weight, I just want to trade some flab for muscle.)

Truth be told, I don't. I'm making a guess based on how I felt and what I've read so far. Part of asking here was to see if there were any other theories that I could investigate.



I don't know if this makes any sense, but maybe I'm not resting long enough between sets when I'm with the trainer compared to when I'm by myself. I'm not sure why that'd make this dramatic a difference, but it is one of the things that comes to mind.

For the second time in four months I've experienced very low blood sugar while working out and it freaked me out. My biggest concern is that I can't figure out for certain what triggered it. Here's what I know:



* I work out at the same time pretty much 5 days a week even if I don't log them all. (6am Monday-Friday)

* I always eat a bowl of cereal for breakfast (typically Kashi GoLean).

* My exercise days rotate between 30-40 minute cardio sessions and 35-45 minute weight lifting.



Both times I've had a problem, I was working out with a trainer switching up my normal routine. 30 minutes into the routine it suddenly hits me, I'm not just tired, I'm about to faint. It takes 30 minutes and a cold pack to snap me back to reality. I can go back two days later and pretty much do the same thing and I'll be fine. Weird, huh?



I have a physical scheduled with my doctor next week and I'll bring it up then, but I'm just trying to get ideas in advance. I really doubt I'm type 2 diabetic, but I'll discuss it with my doctor anyway.

That's the exact same technique my wife taught me! It works really well since you end up with the flavor of the dressing in every bite if you want it and you don't need to worry too much about how many calories or fat grams are in this dressing or that.



It is doubly useful at restaurants and family events.

Is that Fibersure or another product? Fiber makes me feel full for a little while, but just a little while. I'd have to drink about 30g to make it through the day.



My pattern has me eating about every two hours (some times a bit more, others a bit less). My first meal is at 5:15am and the second at 7:30am. There is barely time to get hungry and both meals are smaller than what some of my friends eat for breakfast.

I tend to pack snack foods into my bags while I'm at home. Lots of

fruit strips and Kashi GoLean bars. Maybe not right for you, but for me and my 7 meals a day they work really well.



If I do have to buy food while I'm out, I tend to think small. Get myself through the hunger so I'm not obsessing. I fill myself when I can get a meal some place where it is easy to eat well.



I was listening to the Fitness Rocks podcast yesterday and during an interview they made an interesting point. The food we find on most store shelves is there because it has a really long shelf life. Part of reason those foods have a long shelf life is because they're so nutritionally poor that very little bacteria is drawn to them. Ok, maybe not 100% accurate, but it gave me a new way to look at food.

Here are a few of the things I do, some might work for you.



* 90% rule - I only have to do 90% of what I set out for in the beginning. I try for 100%, but messing up 1 in 10 is still success.



* Planned food - I plan what I'll eat the night before for my first 4 meals so I don't have to think about it while eating. (I eat breakfast, post workout, mid morning, lunch, late afternoon, dinner, and snack. I may very well be a hobbit.)



* Nutrient dense food. I've heard this from researchers and from personal experience that foods with high levels vitamins and proteins trigger a sense of being full much sooner than low nutrient foods. The explanation I was given had to do with your body craving food to get nutrients, not calories.



* Chocolate every day. Seriously. I'm not "on a diet", I'm changing my diet. Part of making this a real change is making it something I can live with and I can live with chocolate every day. Usually just one piece of chocolate from a box, but that's hardly a rough life.

Welcome. How much time do you have for that goal? End of the semester for my friends is next week. I hope you have much more time than that.

D,



7.5 lbs. is great! You'll find that lots of people on Traineo think 1.5 lbs per week is a good pace. Changing our bodies isn't fast or simple. It takes years to gain 70lbs, you won't lose it in 9 months.

When I was first incorporating weight training into my routine, I went to see a trainer. What they came up for me was a relatively short series of 9 compound exercises that were arranged in supersets that flowed with the gym's layout and worked the muscles from largest to smallest, ending with core exercises.



None of that sentence meant anything to me when I started which is why I needed the trainer. I'll break it down in case you don't know all of that.



Compound exercises means that you are using more than one muscle group. For example, a lunge uses several muscle groups in your leg along with exercising your core to help keep you stable. More muscles used means more calories burned in a shorter period.



Supersetting is when you put exercises for two different muscle groups back to back and don't rest in between. So if you're doing a lateral pull downs and an overhead press, you'd do one set of the pull down followed by a set of the press, then back to the pull down, and then back to the press and so on until you've completed all your sets.



Crud, this is a super long post. I'll just end it here and if you have any other questions someone else can jump in.

I've lost 60 lbs before and it takes a long time. If you can do it in a healthy manor within 8 months I'll be impressed.



As for losing weight, cardio and diet will drop all the pounds. Weight training is important for general health and making sure you don't drop muscles. You'll find lots of the Traineo regulars are fans of weight training. Here's why: it works.



Weight training doesn't need to be super intense or complicated, two or three days a week of a total body workout. I'd strongly recommend talking to a trainer at the gym. You'll get better advice for you and your body from a one hour session with a qualified trainer than you will in weeks of surfing the internet.

They've changed the WW point system over the years and I haven't bothered to keep up, but this was the old formula from 8 years ago.



Calories/50 + Fat Grams/12 - Fiber/5 = Points



So if you want to work backwards, take your points and either add a few if your diet is high fiber/low fat or subtract a few if it is low fiber/high fat and then multiply by 50.

Just to maintain your body, someone your size needs between 40g and 80g of protein a day depending on who you listen to.



If you want to eat at Subway, the turkey sub is good for about 18g and the roasted chicken 24g.



I switched from corn flakes to Kashi Go Lean cereal, in part because it isn't just low in calories (150 before milk), but it is high in fiber (10g) and protein (13g). Oh, and I like the taste better.

If you are wearing socks it'll do that.

You program the scale with your age, gender, and height. Then when you use it, it runs a small current through your body and calculates the values based on that.



Early models had lots of problems with accuracy because they couldn't tell the difference between high water retention and fat, but my understanding is they've made significant progress on that front.

My interest in forums waxes and wanes all the time. With the exception of my motorcycle mailing list that has been going on since May '99, I'll participate for a few months and then take some time off.



I consider the flexibility to do that a good thing.

One thing you may want to look into is a Tanita scale. Many of their scales measure weight, body fat %, water retention, bone mass, and other details that can help you figure out what you're losing.

One thing I'd suggest, start writing down exactly what you eat (meal time and snacks) and what you do physically. Almost everyone over estimates their physical activity and under estimates how much they eat so writing it down is critical. That'll give you a baseline to start from and you can make choices about increasing activity and reducing food intelligently.