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traineo Community / Diet & Nutrition Tips / Peter Jennings: Obesity in America
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info ~
traineo Newbie
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 # Posted: 2 Oct 2007 16:15


I thought this well written post and video emphasized some points that may be important to keep in mind:

Peter Jennings' Report on Obesity in America

Enjoy!
Splint Chesthair
Fitness Guru
Posts: 471
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 # Posted: 2 Oct 2007 16:24


I couldn't watch the video because I'm at work but I'm always divided about whether the subsidies of "bad" foods is a major cause of U.S. obesity. I understand that the government subsidizes corn and therefore corn syrup is cheaper than sugar, etc. But let's say it all switched tomorrow and the government decided to subsidize vegetables and sugar cane and sugar beets and "junk" food prices rose, how many people would still eat Doritos and drink liters of a soda a day.

One of our friends thinks we're health food nuts just because we have vegetables and fruits in the house and have 2% milk.

Perhaps it would take a while for people to change their habits and if fruits and vegetables were subsidized, they wouldn't be seen as "health" foods but normal everyday foods. But given that people will spend $10 for a pack of cigarettes, it leads me to believe that they will still eat their junk food. Well, like anything else, I guess there are multiple heads to this hydra.
Minu ~
The Master
Posts: 2592
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 # Posted: 2 Oct 2007 17:04 - Edited by: Minu


Quoting: splint
Perhaps it would take a while for people to change their habits and if fruits and vegetables were subsidized, they wouldn't be seen as "health" foods but normal everyday foods.


What? They're NOT normal, everyday foods?

Now ya got me cravin' zuchini.

Wait--that sounded---kinda...

Bon Ap!



Dutch Hauser
traineo Regular
Posts: 45
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 # Posted: 2 Oct 2007 18:59


This post can be rendered meaningless by a single idea: personal accountability.

Seriously, why should the government have to step in and be the ultimate arbiter of people's decisions? There is an unquantifiable amount of readily available information out there that attests to the dangers of eating junk food. It should be up to the individual to know what these dangers are, and then act accordingly. If someone wants to ignore and evade the dangers associated with eating a junk food diet, then let them suffer the consequences.

The government shouldn't have to step in and replace peoples' need to reason for themselves. Why has it become so hip for people to abdicate any and all sense of personal responsibility and accountability to the government?

People spend more time and energy coming up with scapegoats for their self-created problems than they do at pinpointing the direct cause (i.e. their decisions) and coming up with a solution. It's quite pathetic.
Dean Logan
traineo Regular
Posts: 53
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 # Posted: 2 Oct 2007 20:30


Amen Dutch Amen!

It's not the cheese burger that made you fat, it is you that made you fat.
Splint Chesthair
Fitness Guru
Posts: 471
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 # Posted: 2 Oct 2007 20:33


Quoting: Quaid
The government shouldn't have to step in and replace peoples' need to reason for themselves. Why has it become so hip for people to abdicate any and all sense of personal responsibility and accountability to the government?


I agree, but then shouldn't the government also get out of the business of subsidizing foods that are potentially unhealthy? The main reason why junk foods are full of corn syrup and other crap and cheap is because of government subsidies to domestic producers. Seems like they should either stop the practice altogether or subsidize healthier foods/methods of production.

People with little resources tend to purchase the cheapest food sources, i.e. junk food. When the government is keeping the price for these items artificially low, then aren't they creating an environment in which people are more likely to eat these crappy foods?
Adam Goldberg
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 # Posted: 2 Oct 2007 20:52 - Edited by: rurumon


Bingo Splint, the problem isn't government subsidizing the wrong food, it's the atrocious idea of a government subsidy at all. Subsidizing is the antipode of a capitalist society, it gives the weak and failing an excuse to hinder the progress of producers by introducing artificial competition.

Yes, by the government deflating prices the poor see more of a draw to buy cheap food, but I don't see how that is my problem. Crack is also a cheap alternative to eating, if people make the decision to smoke crack and eat hamburgers because they are cheap, it's their own conscious decision. Blaming the government for making crack cheaper doesnt put the crack pipe in the poor man's hand. All we have is our reason, and how you choose to wield that reason is up to you.
Jeff West
Fitness Guru
Posts: 237
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 # Posted: 2 Oct 2007 22:18


Ahhh, politics at Traineo.

It is sad though standing in line at the grocery store and watching a mother who's struggling financially unload her cart with so many highly refined and empty calorie foods. Some of her items are personal choices, but with others items she has no choice, which I sort of think was the point of Jennings report.

Dutch, Dean, Adam, most of the Americans who have poor diets could probably afford to eat healthier, but many American families literally cannot afford to buy the same healthy, nutritious foods that you and I buy. If given the opportunity, what would you say to them?

And Minu, if you care to comment, what's the typical diet of poor people in France? How common are heart disease and diabetes in the French population?
Adam Goldberg
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Posts: 222
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 # Posted: 2 Oct 2007 23:28


Quoting: jwest62
If given the opportunity, what would you say to them?


Work harder
Shannon D
traineo Regular
Posts: 45
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 02:25


Adam, I'd say a single mom holding down two minimum wage jobs to support her children is working pretty hard, and once children are in the picture saying "get a better education so you can be payed more" is rather naive. Furthermore, I knew plenty of kids that worked their way through college. They worked a hell of a lot harder than I did between their jobs and school (and I worked pretty darned hard), but sometimes they still found themselves on a ramen diet. I'm not happy with farm subsidies either, since half the time they're paying farmers to NOT grow food and what they are subsidizing makes it way easier to eat unhealthily than healthily, but I am also not personally comfortable with small children dying of starvation in the streets. I think the solution might involve certainly redistributing and possibly reducing farm subsidies, but the situation is complicated.
Minu ~
The Master
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 10:55


Quoting: jwest62
And Minu, if you care to comment, what's the typical diet of poor people in France? How common are heart disease and diabetes in the French population?


Well, Jeff, I'm happy to not be in that demographic, but I can comment on what I see both on the streets and in the check out lines at the market.

I used to live right in the heart of Paris, and there, on average, most folks are pretty slim--most folks too are fairly well off, (as one has to be to afford flat prices there to start with).

It seems too that general availablity of natural foods is good, with fresh markets on many street corners and outside of metro stations, for example.

After moving to the burbs, I saw the notable contrast in body types--when I go out to walk the pooch, it seems that on average, about 1-2 out of every 10 people I see are overweight, kids and teens included.

In the checkout lines at the grocers, (I always snoop to see what the folks ahead of me are buying ; ), more and more I'm seeing people choosing crap like: cookies, chips, sugar-bomb cereals, hamburger of the lowest grades, pre-deep-fried chicken nugget-type frozen meats, sodas, fake juices, etc.

Granted, these items, for now at least as a rule, do not come in potato-sack-sizes, so that is one difference of note, but the fact that they are selling like hotcakes is pretty poignant.

As far as heart disease and diabetes stats go, I can only imagine that they are both on the rise, along with elevators and the numbers of fastfood joints popping up.
Adam Goldberg
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 13:38 - Edited by: rurumon


Alright, please bear in mind that I am discussing this, not trying to attack anyone.


Quoting: Beguine
"get a better education so you can be payed more" is rather naive.


Never said that

Quoting: Beguine
Adam, I'd say a single mom holding down two minimum wage jobs to support her children is working pretty hard,


No, it's working two minimum wage jobs.

Quoting: Beguine
Furthermore, I knew plenty of kids that worked their way through college. They worked a hell of a lot harder than I did between their jobs and school (and I worked pretty darned hard), but sometimes they still found themselves on a ramen diet.


You've proved nothing except that your friends decided to eat ramen while going through college.

Quoting: Beguine
but I am also not personally comfortable with small children dying of starvation in the streets.


Well, who is? But that's not what this argument is about

Quoting: Beguine
I think the solution might involve certainly redistributing and possibly reducing farm subsidies, but the situation is complicated.


Sounds communist. You can re-distribute and re-evaluate, but the situation is still the same.
Dean Logan
traineo Regular
Posts: 53
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 15:42


I paid my way through college so that my parents could help out my other siblings; I'm the youngest of 6. I didn't eat ramen noodles, but I did budget my meals and didn't eat junk. I did work full time and take a full course load (18 hours). For one semester I even had a morning paper route, full course load and a full time job as a theater manager. Which means I worked 7 days of the week on the paper route and 6 days a week at the theater while taking classes 5 days a week. You'll note, that I didn't have a degree to get the management job, I worked hard at previous jobs, got promoted which allowed me to get management job.

Not to sound harsh, but maybe the mother should have thought about the consequences of getting pregnant and not being able to find a job that pays more than minimum wage. The only workers around here that get paid minimum wage or close to it our wait staff and that's what they get before tips.

It all goes back to responsibility for self. If you get yourself into a situation, get out of it by yourself or have your friends and family help you out. Don't expect my tax dollars or the government to solve your problems, they won't.
Z De Gregorio
traineo Regular
Posts: 28
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 16:05


heated discussion!... but i think it's a bit of a stretch to say the government is responsible for fat people. Economics is more complicated then that. But I do feel everyone's frustration, If we all have to eat a certain amount of calories to survive there is definitely a choice at the supermarket to pay "x" for junk food to reach that calorie point or 5 times that for healthy fruits and vegetables.
Jeff West
Fitness Guru
Posts: 237
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 16:13


Sorry to hear France is becoming so American-ized, Minu. BTW, you write perfect English, transplant?

Why don't we end this thread and be grateful for what all of us here at Traineo have. Thanks for the link Edward - it was insightful - now let's all get back to eating well and exercising!
Amy S
Fitness Guru
Posts: 220
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 16:14


Quoting: Logan6
Not to sound harsh, but maybe the mother should have thought about the consequences of getting pregnant

Of course, I agree with the personal accountability. But wow, everyone has a story. I am working my ass off in every possible way and am beyond offended here. Don't even start to judge. I guess that is not the point of this post, so I will go take a few deep breaths.
Minu ~
The Master
Posts: 2592
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 16:28


Quoting: jwest62
Sorry to hear France is becoming so American-ized, Minu. BTW, you write perfect English, transplant?


Oui-oui, as my poopy-Francais will testify to, monsieur!

Quoting: AmyS
But wow, everyone has a story.


AMEN, Amy. Until we've all "walked a mile...", I think it's only fair to at least try on a lil empathy.

Nice bicep, btw.
Dean Logan
traineo Regular
Posts: 53
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 16:32


Quoting: ZakFilmFanatic
but i think it's a bit of a stretch to say the government is responsible for fat people.


Nobody is saying that.
What we are saying is, take responsibility for yourself and don't look for answers from the government. For everything in life, you should look for the power within yourself to better yourself and your situation.

This site is good and all, but it still takes will power inside of yourself to exercise and eat healthy. Regardless of your situation it is all a matter of sacrifices and rewards. If you can't afford to shop at Whole Foods, it doesn't mean you have to buy a bag of Oreo's at Wal-Mart.

Nobody is going to help you more than you helping yourself. And nothing is more rewarding than meeting a goal by yourself.
Adam Goldberg
Fitness Guru
Posts: 222
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 19:02


Quoting: jwest62

Why don't we end this thread and be grateful for what all of us here at Traineo have.



Why? It's a good discussion on a relevant topic and no one is out of line.

It's sure more engaging that discussing what brand of bran cereal gives you the best bowel movements.
Minu ~
The Master
Posts: 2592
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 19:15 - Edited by: Minu


Allbran, hands down.



Jeff West
Fitness Guru
Posts: 237
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 19:20


Quoting: Minu
Allbran, hands down.


O-M-G LAUGHING OUT LOUD!!!!!!

I wasn't going to dare flame this any further, but THANKS! Laughter IS good medicine.

Double Cheers! (seriously, still laughing..)


Adam Goldberg
Fitness Guru
Posts: 222
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 20:52


Fiber one, no contest. It like, 14 grams in a half cup or something ridiculous.
Minu ~
The Master
Posts: 2592
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 22:24


Alright, score one for Fiber 1, but in my defense, we don't haaaaaaaaave that stuff over here, so in MY WORLD, it's STILL ALLBRAN, (11 grams per 30, I just looked at the box ; ), all the way, (to the loo 'n back)...



Splint Chesthair
Fitness Guru
Posts: 471
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 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 22:43


What was the name of that cereal from SNL?

Man: Hmm.. Colon Blow. Sounds delicious. But is it really higher in fiber than my oat bran cereal?

Announcer: Take a guess: How many bowls of your oat bran cereal would it take to equal the fiber content of one bowl of Colon Blow?

Man: Two?

Announcer: Guess again.

Man: Three?

Announcer: A little higher.

Man: Four?

Announcer: Keep trying.

Man: Five?

Announcer: No, you'll have to do better than that.

Man: Seven?

Announcer: Guess again.

Man: Eight?

Announcer: We'll give you one more guess.

Man: Nine.

Announcer: Not even close. [ table starts shaking ] It would take over 30,000 bowls. [ a giant pyramid of cereal bowls shoots up from under the man, who yells in terror as it rises ] To eat that much oat bran, you'd have to eat ten bowls a day, every day for eight and a half years.

Man: [ after the pyramid settles; shouts from afar ] Wow! I think I get the picture! Colon Blow must be the highest fiber cereal on the market!

Announcer: Not any more, now that there's new Super Colon Blow.

Man: Super Colon Blow?

[ pyramid rises even higher with the man screaming ]

Announcer: It would take over two and a half million bowls of your oat bran cereal to equal the fiber content of one bowl of Super Colon Blow.
Minu ~
The Master
Posts: 2592
Post History
 # Posted: 3 Oct 2007 22:54


Man, this thread's really gone down the toilet.

* "rim" shot *

And yes, that was some classic SNL!



Jeff West
Fitness Guru
Posts: 237
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 # Posted: 4 Oct 2007 00:07


Quoting: rurumon
Fiber one, no contest. It like, 14 grams in a half cup or something ridiculous.


That's the spirit Adam! Cheers.
Jocelyn Coutant
Fitness Guru
Posts: 222
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 # Posted: 4 Oct 2007 02:00


i loveeeee that stuff! we have like 8 boxes of it in our house when it's on sale haha.
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