Since it looks like heavy weight lifting is permanently off my list of activities (check your mirrors, don't hit cyclists with your mini vans), I've decided to make a runner of myself. Some questions...

- Pretty much all the workout plans and what have you that I look at have you running every other day. Is it such a bad plan to run consecutive days? I've only been working on it for three weeks now, but I love it, and can hardly stand to rest or crosstrain more than two days a week or so (though I do vary the intensity of my runs).

- Any of you use a heart rate monitor when you run? Your thoughts and suggestions?

I just got up to real running some of the time (6+ mph) instead of always jogging (< 6 mph), and actually managed to run a mile in just under 9 minutes yesterday, so I'm rediculously stoked on this new hobby of mine. I can't believe the progress I've already made in only three weeks time. If you have any other bits of wisdom, I'm happy to hear it.

Okay, let's just correct few of your statements first:


There are no set speeds to go from running to jogging because these terms really have no real meaning. Pretty much anything where you would no longer consider yourself walking is running. When I do my LSD (long slow distance) runs we run at about 6:45 minute km. That's < 6mph but is considered running.


I have one, but from everything I've heard, they're not really worthwhile until you can run consistently for at least 30 minutes and have built up your base. But really, the idea of using them (to judge how hard your running) can be done by just using the talk test. If you can talk easily, you'd be running around an LSD pace, if you can only gasp out words, you're at your 80% max pace.


Sort of. Running is hard on your body which is why its always suggest working your way into it. You need to recover between running sessions. You can do consecutive days as long as you're varying your workouts. You don't want to do two hard workouts back to back. It's recommended to increase your weekly mileage by no more than 10% every week. And even when doing that to reduce your mileage every few weeks.

Most beginner running programs suggest running only 3 times a week until you can easily run 30 minutes at a time. It's also strongly recommended that you don't work on improving your speed until you have a good base mileage, this being that it's easy to injure yourself doing this, and a lot of speed just comes from having that base mileage.

The one piece of advice I received that I think was key, was to not become a "one speed runner." This means to have different type runs - like the LSD which would be your longest weekly run, but run fairly slow, you should be able to hold a conversation. Or do tempo's, a run where you are starting to gasp, and could only say short sentences. Or hills, which are a good strength training workout and should be done where you can't gasp out much more than a single word.

However, a lot of this advice really depends on what your running goals are. If you just want to run for fitness/exercise, then 30 minutes at a time is enough. If you want to train to run distance x, then start by building up your weekly mileage and then look for a training program to help your progress.

(And don't forget to make sure you have a good pair of running shoes)

Hey Josephine,

I would suggest that you map out a couple of 5Ks to run during the year, they are great for motivation, to keep you running and push yourself.

The best thing you can do to help yourself get better at running is to run down to your local library and pick up a running book and use it to formulate a running program for yourself.

Running every day can be beneficial as long as you do light runs in between hardcore runs, giving yourself around 48 hours between high effort runs.

Congrat on the running progress ;) keep at it, it sounds like you're doing really well.

Thanks all. I looked up the running vs. jogging thing, and found that definition in a couple places. So that's where that came from, and therefore it became a goal to be able to get to where I could maintain a speed of 6 mph or more for more than two minutes at a time. Which I've done now, and I feel like a badass. Heh.

I can easily keep moving for 40+ minutes, so that's not an issue. I'm usually doing 5k, trying to gradually increase my speed for that distance, and then I'll just keep moving easily at a slow, comfy pace to round out 60 minutes of total time on the treadmill. I'm cutting about 40 seconds or so off my 5k time each week, nice and gradual like. I definitely want to try doing 5k races/events, but, I'll be happier if I get a little more speed first. I'm pretty competitive, I could see myself overdoing it or being disapointed if I go into it at my current speed. On Monday, I did my 5k in 37:15, my best yet. Huzzah!

Workouts are pretty light. For example, I did 7 miles total on Monday, split into two workouts about 8 hours apart. Yesterday, I only did three miles, two fast and one very very easy. Today, I'm making myself do the stair climber nice and slow, and maybe a quick little jog just to get it out of my system, half a mile maybe. A decent compromise?

Thanks for the suggestions. I will definitely get a book (one cannot live by magazines alone, silly me) and I have already invested in a pair of Brooks shoes that I may eventually be burried in. Ha!

I'd be more concerned about doing more than one workout on the same day, then doing them consecutive days.

You may want to start choosing one day of the week to be a longer run, and try to add distance to that run each week. So say, try to do 4 miles this week, and then next week 4.5, and so on. Try to find a pace where you can do the whole run without having to stop. Or, if you want to go a bit faster, do 10 and 1's. The running room is a huge proponent of 10 and 1's, but we only do them on the LSD days. It allows you to let your heart rate recover a bit.

You could also choose a day to do 5k time runs, maybe every 1-2 weeks, where you try and see how fast you can go.

If you feel the need to run, use it as your warm-up/cool-down on your non running days. Just do about 10 minutes.

A word of warning (not the bad kind), if you're doing all your training on a treadmill, running a 5k outside will be a shock, so make sure to incorporate some outside training as well. The treadmill paces you, but outside you have to set/maintain the pace. Also, if you run at a 0 incline, there's many arguments that say its easier to run because there's less friction. It's usually recommended to up it to minimum 1% to try and mimic the wind resistance.

Oh... and if you use itunes/ipods there's a download called Master the Treadmill with Ok-Go. If you can handle their music (I don't mind it, my sister doesn't like it) it's kind of fun. It has you do intervals starting at 30 seconds to 2 minutes. And since it doesn't set paces for you, you can use it as another gauge of your fitness level as you are able to up the speed you run the intervals/rest periods at.

Thanks again Neesha, lot's of great suggestions.

The reason for the split, is that I'm chained to a desk at work. I can't bloody stand it, my energy level get's reved up and I will get anxious without an outlet. Three workouts a day is pretty standard for me, and is about right to actually wear me out and keep the anxiety at bay. During my lunch at work I'll usually do a mile, or some light, fun supersets, just a little something to get my blood going and make my work day bareable. It's before and/or after work that I'll actually put in some real effort.

I definitely think you're right about getting outside. I know that I need to, but I just get such a kick out of all the numbers on the treadmill, I really like feedback. Also, I worry about hurting myself, and like the relative softness of the treadmill vs. pavement and such. I've promised myself I'll go explore the parks and stuff around Seattle at some point. All these hills, phew! I think I'll wait till it starts raining again for that... Heh. I'll definitely give the Master the Treadmill thingy a go though. I LOVE podrunner, having a beat my legs can stick with is rediculously helpful.

Holy cow!! So many showers and changing and hair and makeup!!



Run on dirt or ground of some type. Pavement is not good for the knees.

That's awesome that you have a new love for running!

Do some HIIT.

I ran track for years and the hardest workouts were never the long runs... it was always the Sprint/jogs/sprint/jogs/etc... 8 sets of 400 like that kills...

You have a few different options.

Treadmills = good when you don't have another option. They help you run because its moving. I have ran with alot of folks who 'treadmill' for 30-60 minutes with ease and once their outside on a track their dead in under 20 minutes. Bump up the elevation 2-4 notches and run that way.

Outside on a good track = good. Better than running on concrete. Dirts a close second, but rubber is great. Find a good one and put on some tunes and start zoning. The bad thing is running for a long distance isn't bad but you need to be able to constantly push it... I ran 5 miles a day 6 days a week for years and only saw drastic improvement when running with others and pushing ourselves daily.

Run backwards = WOW... wana give your legs something else to help them grow and stay balanced? run a mile backwards... sure you'll have to work up to it and probably look silly at first, but you'll find out why this is tuffer than it sounds. You'll work your muscles differently and when you throw this into your bag of tricks 1 - 2x's a week and you'll find you will have a much better kick/stride/strength in your legs will grow. Plus theres nothing more enjoyable then lapping people while running backwards because you can acutally see they look on their face

Long runs... I"m not a big fan of them any more for everyday stuff. I can burn more calories doing a HIIT, improve my VO2 alot more and still run a good distance when need too. Their more of a maintance thing every week at most. Once every 2 weeks worked good for me.


I have a F11 heart rate (polar) monitor and it works great. Each week on the same day (saturday for example) measure your resting heart rate. Track it for a few months and see how it changes. It should start to lower the 'healthier' you get.

Now all this is said from an ex runner who has let life run past him and doesn't run how he wants to any more... alas being in charge and having a 3.5 year old, 2 year old and another bun in the oven takes away from the workout schedule

Gluck with your desires tho to become a good runner

I disagree with a lot of stuff here. I think my success in running is dependent on two things:
1) differentiating between running for fitness and running to be a good runner.
2) cross-training and rest.

Please sign up for some races and look up the Furman FIRST training program. You should be on your way, and you'll avoid injury, which I am scared you're headed for now.

Running on trails or on the beach is harder for me. I guess it's important, but ugh.

Hey Bean, I was wondering what you disagree with? I think what has been said as advice is within your two points. But I always like to hear more opinions/views.

I agree with the 2 points of Bean.

It all depends on your goal.

I have been running for a little bit more than 1 yr. I ran 3 to 4 times per week. The other days are either weight training or yoga. I have 1 full rest day also.

There are many running school and styles. I started with Galloway run/walk. It took me thru 3 full marathons and a few half marathon. I am not a speed runner though. Now, I am trying out Chi Running. It is teaching me to be slower and focus on form and Chi energy.

Josephine, if you don't want to spend the $ for any running school, you can find a lot of running programs in the net. RunnersWorld.com has a Smart Coach to tailor training for you. You can try CoolRunning also.

Wait, there's such a thing as running school??? Really? Omg, that'd be perfect, I would LOVE to have someone help me do this right. Any suggestions on how to go about finding one?

I'm not sure about running schools, but a lot of running stores have running clubs (or cults ;)). I go to the Running Room which is a Canadian brand with a few stores in the US.

The Running clubs are usually free to join, and have once or twice weekly practice runs where you can meet and run with other people. They also often hold clinics to help you train to run distance x (but these usually cost money). The benefit of these things really depends on the person. I had one friend who told me "why do you need to go to a store to run?" But I'm not sure I'd have the discipline to go out and do hill training on my own (especially in 25+ weather) or to find interesting 15k+ runs. Plus, it's nice to meet others with similar goals, since I don't have any friends who are really into running.

THIS THREAD DISPLEASES ME!

STOP YOUR RUNNING IMMEDIATELY AND PICK UP HEAVY THINGS!

Hahahahahahaha Word.

In all seriousness, I would sell my soul to be able to deadlift and bench again. But the fact of the matter is that my ligaments and bones in my wrist are just too effed up. The likelyhood of me ever putting up more than 20lbs or so without assistance is about nil. I am in the process of looking for someone who can set me up with custom braces that will put the weight entirely on my forearm, so that I can at least do some significant amount of weight. So far, no leads. Way I figure, surely there are vetrans coming home with missing or non-functioning hands, and someone must be helping some of them lift despite their injury. I just don't know who...

I know. This is just a depressing thread. I'd hate to think of anyone's interests in moving metal cut short.

Have you considered more high intensity cardio? Like why not become a competitive rower? at least then you might hang on to some muscle mass.

Rowing, again, would put too much repetitive stress on my wrist. For the time being, it's not an option. Yesterday, in trying to think of how to get myself to crosstrain and not bloody hurt myself (my WORST nightmare at this point...), I had a thought; why just make a runner out of me when I could try and make a triathlete out of me? So, I plan to do some reading over the weekend and in the mean time, the idea of it was exciting enough to get me on a bike for an hour this morning.

Swimming, would potentially be awesome for maintaining a little muscle mass. I'm also doing the most wicked supersets I can come up with, with my puny little 10 pound dumbells the doctors let me get away with. It takes a lot of reps and a lot of time, but, I can eventually fatigue my muscles a a bit. And hey, I'll always have squats...

Want to add weight while running?

Sprints, short fast, up hill, drag a sled

Ever notice the difference between a sprinter and a long distance runner?

Tiz a reason in High School why I could squat 450x5.

When I stopped doin cross country and focused on speed my legs really started to develop well.

Oh, definitely, I'm more hot on speed than distance. I'd much rather do a blazing 5k than ever run a marathon. Right now though, I think it's crucial to re-develop my cadiovascular capacity, and to eliminate the excess fat I've accumulated while going through surgeries and recovery. I also think it's crucial to develop good form. So, except for occasional tries for personal records at one mile for motivation and entertainment, I'll stick to just conditioning myself.

A good plan? Yes/no?

Honestly Hills/inclines

Find a small grade and run up it. Running up a slight incline will help with form. The way you have to run to do it (not a big incline btw) will cause your stride to be better on flat surfaces.

For a good mile I used to run HIIT before it became what it was. I ran 4:45 miles by 7th grade. It came from running 400x400x400x400x400xetc for 8 laps. Run 400, rest 1 minute and repeat. Best Mile for me was 4:30 and best 1.5 mile for me was 6:58. I rarely ran long distance after my Freshman year.

Lots of good sites out there will teach form. The joy of it is everyones form is slightly different as everyone has a different gate. Some people run on the outside of their foot, some on the inside, and some right down the middle. Some pick up their knees more and some dont. Go visit a barnes n noble or something like that and read a book on running then go try out some of what it says.

I think you'll find that 10-20 minutes of intense running a day will drop your 1 mile speed alot faster than jogging 30-50 minutes. Toss in a long day just for fun every 2 weeks (say 3 miles - 5 miles) and keep a good pace.

Also Jumps, lunges, bleachers, stuff like that is good for muscle strength for sprint type runs. An 800 is considered the last of the sprints by most but you'll see alot of milers consider that a sprint too...

Josephine, "running school" is only the term that I used. Like Neesha said, there are many runner clubs you can join. Do search about running clubs around your area in internet, you will find some. Many runner gear stores like the Snailplace, Road Runner Sports, have weekly running schedule, you can just go and join as you wish.

I will not judge whose idea is the best or worst here. We are only telling you the ideas. Whatever best work for you is the best. Hope you find something helpful for you.

HUGE thanks again to everyone for your suggestions!

So, I crosstrained these last two days, ZERO running except for a quick 50 ft or so to get to the liquor store yesterday before it closed.

Today, I went to the track at the college down the street to see if my treadmill 5k skills would translate well at all. Lo and behold, I did my fastest 5k yet, 32:06! That's about 5 full minutes faster than my best 5k on the treadmill. Who knew? I have a mad gift for quick recovery, so after walking for about half a mile I tried some hill sprints. Found a short little hill behind my flat, sprinted up and then walked down 5 times. Loved it. A totally different kind of challenge.

The plan now is to shower, and then acquire some reading material as recommended above. Great success!

It's important, while you're reading things, to maintain a sense of logic. Keep in mind always that taking a day off, or even a few days off, will not take away your fitness. It just won't. Also, ask yourself why you are doing a particular training method. Every day you go out to train, be able to answer the question "What is the purpose of this exercise?"

But again, I can't really figure out if you want to be a competitive 5k runner (which would be awesome, and fitness would come as a result), or if you just want to run and lose some weight.

If it's the latter, get out there for 30 minutes a day doing run/walk and keep your heart rate in the 60% range. You shouldn't be sore any day because the exercise is that easy.

If you want to be competitive, you should need a day of rest pretty frequently. Sometimes I don't know if I can drive back home after some of my workouts.

And Bourblaster needs to chill out. Cross-train like a triathlete, and you won't get the decrepit form of a runner. You'll cut up naturally and appear both well-fed and steroid-free.

Ha! Love it, thanks Bean.

Sorry, suppose I should have been more clear on my goals.I would be absolutely thrilled to get to the point of being a competitive 5k runner. Being competitive in sprint triathalons (at least looking at wikipedia, that's the kind of distance and such that interests me most) would probably give me fits of joy. The idea's really appealing. Naturally, weight loss will come along with this. I have no interest in being "skinny", really. I want to look like an athlete, a badass.

Yes, rest is critical, I know that from lifting. Tomorrow will probably involve nothing but walking. Sunday I'll do something fun and easy. Woo!

Me too Josephine! That is exactly how I feel. "Skinny" is totally not my thing. I know people who are "skinny" but probably have a BF% in the upper 20s.

Here are some good references if you really are interested in sprint tris - which I highly recommend btw because they are awesome. And I have put on a crap ton of muscle training for them.

trifind

tri-newbies

beginner triathlete

Thanks Rachael! Awesome, I'm glad I'm not the only one. I'll totally checked out those links.

I picked up a couple books this weekend; "Your First Triathlon", "Run Less, Run Faster", and "The Runner's World Injury Prevention Guide". I already plowed through the tri book, which was a perfect primer, and I'm almost done with Run Less. Totally following that program, and already tried one of the workouts yesterday, and it was great. Kicked my butt, though it was short and doable. Can't wait to see if I can actually pull off the tempo run tomorrow. Yikes! The program has you run only three times a week, perfect to go with my flirtations with tri training and to keep me from over doing it.

Thanks again to everyone! If anyone has a favorite running book of any sort, I'd love to know. I'm plowing through these things. Nerd like woah...

You got my favorite (Run Less, Run Faster). I'm proud.

Huzzah! Yeah, love that book. Highly recomended on principle, if not experience just yet. These workouts are a blast though. Totally rocked the tempo this morning. Hard, yeah, but doable and quick enough that I had plenty of time to stretch and ice a little ache I noticed in my foot.

Well as far as training, that's a good bit to read. Why don't you read stuff about the mental game when you're competing? Anything for the push on that last mile of a 5k or the run section of a triathlon...

EDIT: Titles coming soon.

For 'bad ass' looking im a big fan of cross fit.

Some of those women would kick my but just by blinking at me...

http://www.crossfit.com/